Apple users! Please let us know if this fixed the issue with time encoding. We have switched to an Apple product to do our final encoding to MP3 (This took quite a bit because Paul HATES Apple)
Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded on Wednesday, March 19th, 2014. I’m Paul Lathrop
Rachel: I’m Rachel Malone and on tonights show we talk with Frank Fiamingo about the war on self-defense in New Jersey.
Rob: I’m Rob Morse and we also have an interview with Glen Tate who makes a major announcement, and two crazy Canadians talking about the latest canadian firearms regulations.
Rachel: so climb aboard
Rob: strap in
Paul: and hang on. Episode 221 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.
Show intro music.
Personal news from each participant
Paul- is parked and waiting for a load.. earning a few dollars an hour.
Rachel- is working politics by night and teaching music by day. I have no time to sleep. I’m connecting political activists to their county political conventions.
Rob- I was looking at mid sized 9mm firearms. I rented the Glock 17, the Springfield XD and the CZ-75. Each is a double stack 9mm with a four in inch barrel.. yet they are very different. The obvious missing comparison is the Smith and Wesson M&P, but someone was renting that at the time.
Weight- Glock 17 is lightest of the three. The XD is slightly heavier, though the XD and Glock both have polymer lowers. The CZ has a fairly heavy steel frame and is the heaviest by far. The CZ loaded with 10 rounds was almost as heavy as my empty 1911. The perceived recoil was directly related to the weight of the gun and the CZ didn’t move much when you fired it. The CZ would be fine if you were buying a competition gun or a house gun. The Glock and XD would be much better if you were going to carry them every day for self-defense. It also means that a new shooter who is recoil sensitive should consider the heavier firearms.
The three handguns have a different shape to the stock and feel entirely different in your hand. That is the reason you want to go to a range that rents a wide selection of firearms. The back of the Glock is broad and straight. It fits in your hand as if you’re grabbing the back of a thick hardcover book. I could reach around the stock (or grip) with my thumb, but people with smaller hands would have to roll their thumb around the Glock to get the gun to fit into the web between their thumb and forefinger. When you do that, it feels like you’re grabbing the side of the gun rather than grabbing the back of the gun. In contrast, the top of the CZ grip is nicely narrow and fits well into the groove between your thumb and index finger. I thought the CZ had the best fit in that it was narrower at the top and arched to fit into your palm. The XD is between the two. The XD has a slightly arched grip which also slightly narrows at the web of your thumb. The XD was not as good as the CZ but better than the Glock.
Here are the safety features for each firearm. The CZ has a single/double action trigger and a manual safety thumb safety. The XD has a grip safety and a trigger safety like the Glock. The Glock has only a trigger safety, but it has a considerably harder trigger pull.
Those are the features of the gun that are hard to change. The feel of the trigger can be changed, but I’ll report on the stock firearm.
You could identify each gun by its trigger. XD was actually a little light at 4-4.5 pounds. The CZ in single action was intermediate, and that surprised me. The double action was only a little heavier than the Glock. The Glock was heavy at 7 to 8 pounds. Again, triggers can be adjusted by a trained gunsmith.
When it came to trigger reset, the glock was the best. I thought the XD was next and my shooting buddy thought the CZ was next. Again, the perceived firmness of the reset was proportional to the weight of the trigger pull. You simply can’t have a light target trigger with a distinct reset.
I put about 20 rounds through each gun. I started with dry fire of each firearm. Then I shot a half dozen slow fire, and then went to controlled pairs. I did not test the CZ for accuracy shooting it as a double action handgun, but I did dry fire it in double action.
I tested the time it took to get a second shot. The XD was fastest due to the combination of features; it had the lighter trigger and a fairly good reset. In contrast, the good reset of the Glock was offset by the harder trigger pull. The low recoil of the CZ was offset by its mushy reset. A trigger job could reverse these rankings, but there are limits. I was looking for a carry gun, not a target gun or competition gun. Let me be clear that each firearm is absolutely acceptable in its speed to deliver a second shot.
Controls- For each of these handguns, the slide release is much easier to use than the forward position on the 1911. That is because of better engineering and a lighter recoil spring for a 9mm handgun. With my large hands, I bumped into the slide release by accident on the XD. In contrast, I had to hunt for the magazine release button into the grip on the Glock because they blend it into the stock. You can master it with practice, and they make extended magazine release buttons for the Glock.
I’m going to include this next comment in with controls because it affects how you handle the gun. The slide of the CZ is not very deep. The slide sits on top of the frame rather than wraps around it. The CZ also has an external hammer. It was harder to do a press check on the CZ than either of Glock or the XD because I had trouble getting a good grip on the slide. I couldn’t do a press check on the CZ if the hammer was down. This could be an issue with new shooters when they are learning to manipulate the slide of their firearm. The slide would be easier to manipulate if you have smaller hands. It isn’t a big issue, but it is a difference between the firearms. You won’t notice this issue after you’ve lived with the your gun for a month.
The CZ has a double action/ single action trigger system. That means you could carry it loaded and uncocked after you manually lower the external hammer. Your first trigger pull would be harder and longer, but the second pull would be single action only. I’m used to carrying a gun loaded, cocked and locked, so I don’t see the strong advantage of the double action trigger on the CZ, particularly when the CZ has a manual thumb safety to prevent negligent discharge.
I have long arms, so all the sights were too wide for me. By too wide I mean that the front blade filled up the notch in the rear sight. That is fine for target work, but not for everyday carry. A gunsmith can change sights. A gunsmith can change the weight and feel of a trigger. So each gun could be fitted to your preferences. Oddly enough, in slow fire I was most accurate with the Glock, and I think that was because of the slight difference in the sights that were fitted to this particular firearm.
As it came out of the box, I thought the XD had the best blend of features for a new shooter.
Seg 2- News
Opening rant: It is time that we put “Sheepdogs, Sheep and Wolves” to bed.
1) Shepherds protect the flock. Sheepdogs take orders from shepherds and are nearly worthless without the training and direction that they get from the shepherds.
2) I am not a sheepdog. I am not your (or anyone elses) protector. If I witness you getting robbed, you are going to get robbed. Unless you are in imminent danger of being killed or permanently disabled I am going to try to be a good witness and try to help the police apprehend the bad guy by being a good witness. If I think that you are about to lose your life if I don’t act, I will act IF I CAN. I don’t carry for you, I carry for me and my family. If I am carrying at the time the crime is going on it means that YOU TOO have the ability to carry if you chose to. I don’t have a super duper license that allows me to carry in every circumstance everywhere. I have a South Dakota CPP, if you are in SD or a State that has reciprocity with SD you too can protect yourself.
3) I am not a sheep. I am aware of my surroundings. I am responsible for my own defense.
4) I am not a wolf. I am a card carrying good guy.
5) Unless you have taken an oath as a police officer you could easily make things a lot worse by getting involved. Please don’t delude yourself on citizens arrest. Also, are you SURE you are about to intervene on behalf of the good guy?
6) In our community we are really big on saying “whatever happened to personal responsibility?” when someone blames McDonald’s hot coffee for their own stupidity and wins a big settlement. The same question comes about when a criminal gets off with a light sentence for a heinous crime because he was abused as a child. Where is that same question when a person becomes a victim in a free state where he or she had the legal right to defend themselves? Didn’t the victim have the personal responsibility to take care of themselves including security? Don’t get me wrong here. I DO NOT want to start blaming victims for crimes. What I am saying is that if more people were protecting themselves the criminal population would dwindle dramatically because #1 the criminals don’t commit more crimes once they are incarcerated or in a grave, and #2 Once homey sees that a few of his friends are in jail for a long time and a few more are ventilated he might start thinking that going back to school might make the rest of his time on the planet a bit safer.
7) I have been accused a bit of being a jerk, and worse, for my stance. That is fine with me. The fact is that my #1 goal is to survive for my family. A few episodes ago we had a story about 2 men who entered a house that they didn’t live in and confronted a burglar. I was asked recently what would cause me to enter a house like that. To be honest not much. If my wife or member of my immediate family were in immediate danger and I knew that the police weren’t going to be there in time, then yes, of course. The number of people I would do that for on the face of the earth number less than 20, and most of them are directly related to me.
Am I a Sheep? No. Am I a Sheep Dog? No. I am Damn sure not a Wolf or a Shepherd. I am an independent and free citizen of the United States of America. I don’t fit into the little categories that you try to make so please don’t put me there.
(Commentary – And please feel free to let me have it if you think that I am full of it)
Rob- The original sheep versus sheepdog story was a simple contrast. Now you’ve gone and made it highbrow. You went from two pieces; sheep and sheepdog. Three pieces, sheep, sheepdog and shepard. You have four pieces, complacent citizens, criminal predators, law enforcement and a trained armed citizen who is self-controlled. Your description IS more accurate. But I see two problems with it.
First, most journalists and politicians aren’t smart enough to keep the characters straight until you put costumes and makeup on them. Second, how can you scare the public with a “return to the wild west with blood flowing in the streets” story if there are four characters. Public policy needs simple victims and heros. Your version is simply too complicated to make thrilling news or sound bites.
Oh, Paul… that is a good thing.
Rachel: Roadgunner’s Mag 40 class in Conway, Arkansas at Shoot House USA is scheduled for May 15th thru 18th 2014 you can register here. The Shooting portion of the class is full, however you can still get in on the 2 day citizens rules of engagement. once completing the classroom portion you can get in touch with Chaz and schedule a Mag 20 live fire and complete the mag 40.
Paul: Also please check out Kathy Jackson’s Cornered Cat training classes. Her next class is at Carry On Colorado starting April 4 in Casle Rock, Colorado.
Rob- Story #1 Ares Armor
Daniel Butcher is the Assistant U.S. Attorney that filed a response to temporary restraining order (TRO) obtained by Ares Armor against the ATF. He filed the response with a federal magistrate judge who allowed the raid to proceed. Butcher’s response conveniently “forgets” that the 80% lower receivers stocked and sold by Ares Armor are not generally considered firearms, according to the ATF’s own determination letters sent to numerous manufacturers over the years. Somehow, the all-important detail that the 80-percent polymer lower receivers have not been proven to be firearms didn’t seem to work it’s way into the DOJ’s “Factual Background” section of their response. I doubt the judge cares or will hold Attorney Butcher in contempt for misleading the court. If anything, Attorney Butcher sealed his nomination into a politically appointed DOJ position.
The owner of Ares Armor, Dimitrios Karras, has a sense of humor. The Ares website boasts that all of its products shipped this month have been personally inspected by the BATFE for product quality. Dimitrios is also a combat veteran. I also found out that the company pays employee bonuses in silver coins.
Paul- Oklahoma Sheriffs went to the state capitol to testify as they had in previous years. This year, the 40 sheriffs met a surprising obstacle. They were turned away at the door because a state Senator complained they were armed. Rather than disarm, the sheriffs went back to their counties and scheduled their testimony for another day.
(Rachel’s comments: (1) At least they were being consistent and applying the law equally to the sheriffs and to citizens, and (2) That’s *one* thing that Texas can hold over Oklahoma’s head at least for a little while longer: CHLers can carry in our Capitol building.)
Rob- http://www.ccdl.us/aboutus/events/277-gun-rights-rally There is a gun rights rally in Hartford Connecticut scheduled for April 5th. Connecticut deserves our support.
Rachel – Jacksonville College in East Texas wanted to increase campus safety, and allow employees to carry guns on campus. That’s when they hired chief of security Mike Morse, and began a security agency on campus. Morse is now teaching security officer certification, and concealed handgun classes. “We had a desire to provide courses to the community, and one of the needs we heard was handgun licenses.” Classes are available to the students, teachers, and entire community.
– Jitterz Java has had 3 break-ins in the past month
– Employees are now arming themselves with the approval and encouragement of the owner, Sara Chapel
– Employee Krystal Cogswell: “Before, I never felt an immediate threat, so I would just have it off to the side or somewhere hidden. But now I feel like if someone can see it, maybe it will just deter it right then and there and I won’t ever have to use it,” she explained.
– Customers have been overwhelmingly supportive. Only one complaint.
– Spokane Police said it is completely legal as long as the employees who are armed are 18 and older and do not have any prior convictions that restrict them from using firearms.
Rachel- It turns out that Delaware citizens don’t lose all their civil rights when they accept public housing. This time their rights are protected by the Delaware constitution more so than the US constitution. The Delaware Supreme Court read from the Delaware Constitution’s right to bear arms provision- “A person has the right to keep and bear arms for the defense of self, family, home and State, and for hunting and recreational use” and the court noted that this language may justify broader protection than that given by the Second Amendment. It looks like some of the Delaware housing projects will comply, but some housing administrators are crafting new regulations. Two steps forward, and one step back, but it is progress.
Rob: Gun Quotes (here are two of them, so take your pick of great women on Wednesdays)
How a politician stands on the Second Amendment tells you how he or she views you as an individual… as a trustworthy and productive citizen, or as part of an unruly crowd that needs to be lorded over, controlled, supervised, and taken care of. – Dr. Suzanna Gratia Hupp
Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with lots of news about self-defense news in New Jersey. We start with an interview with Frank Fiamingo. But first, here is a message a sponsor.
Seg 3 Interview with Frank Fiamingo
Rob- That was a fascinating interview with Frank. The link to the James Kaleda defense fund is at indiegogo.com He needs another 10 thousand dollars for his defense, and he needs it in the next ten day.
http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/james-kaleda-s-legal-defense-fund Please donate $10 if that is all you can afford. Please put in something to let James know he is not alone in this battle for our rights. (Any comments?)
The issue of firearms restrictions is not that complex. People are not criminals because they have 15 cartridges in their magazine versus 10 rounds. The Youtube video of 9 year old firearms competitor Shyanne Roberts testifying at the Assembly hearing went viral. Shayanne gets it.
Here is a one minute clip from my friend Anthony Colandro testifying at the New Jersey Assembly.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUE6N5q65eQ&feature=youtu.be He states that “he will not comply” with the new firearms restrictions. For the last 20 years we have been in an era when laws are too numerous to know or obey. Now we are entering an era when more and more citizens deliberately refuse to comply. (comments?)
Paul- We have to go to break.
Go to break
Interview with Matthew McLatchey of Slam Fire Radio and Peter Dawson(Ten- X) about the Canadian RCMP gun ban.
Seg 4 Glenn Tate pt 1
Seg 5 Glenn Tate pt 2
Segment 6 DGUs
The chat room warriors contributed this, and thank you to them- “When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty.” Thomas Jefferson
Rob- A man was shot and killed early Monday morning as he was attempting to burglarize a home northwest of Corvallis, Montana. The resident was awakened by noises around his home shortly before 4 a.m.. When he went to investigate, he found someone climbing through a window. When the resident ordered the man to not move, the suspect turned toward him. The resident was armed with a handgun and shot the intruder, who then jumped back through the broken window and ran away from the home. The intruder was later found dead near the home. The dead man, Tobias Ian Bishop, age 39, had a long criminal history and was wanted on an outstanding warrant. Bishop had burglarized several other properties in the area and had several stolen chainsaws stashed near his van.
Paul: Police say that one man is in critical condition after attempting to break into an Apache Junction Arizona Home. Three men gathered in the back of a home when they were noticed by the homeowner on surveillance video. Those gathered out back began to kick the back door. The homeowner grabbed a shotgun and one other person inside the house was armed with a handgun. Once the second person was illuminated with a laser sight, the homeowner and the second person in the home opened fire. The 3 attackers fled. one of them, 19 year old Sal Anthony Almos only made it to the neighbors yard where he collapsed from a shotgun wound to the groin and upper legs. Almos was taken into custody, and he later told investigators that the attackers were heavily armed and had zip ties and “were ready for whatever” I am thinking that a shotgun blast to the groin wasn’t included in whatever. Also the picture on the webpage that reports the story has a mug shot of an apparently easily standing Almos, something I seriously doubt he can do while in critical condition in a hospital, so it appears that this isn’t his first rodeo.
Rachel- Police are investigating the homicide of a 26-year-old man who was shot after police say he brandished a handgun and sexually assaulted a woman. The name of the man has not been released pending notification of family members. It happened around 9:25 p.m., Thursday, in the 3800 block of North Rampart Street [New Orelans LA]. Police said the 26-year-old man approached a man and woman as they were walking. They said he then produced a gun and demanded that they walk to a building that was being renovated. Once they entered the yard, investigators say, the man sexually assaulted the woman at which time the adult male disarmed the man and fatally shot him… (Once a gain, we see how much more common it is for a criminal to get shot with his own gun, by a victim, than vice versa.) http://www.wdsu.com/news/local-news/new-orleans/man-fatally-shot-in-new-orleans/24970126
Rachel – student speaks out against being disarmed
– University of Cincinnati campus
– engineering student came across 4 students being attacked on campus, jumped in to help them
– ended up beaten, hospitalized
– “One of the victims said that the area was usually safe, so the Saturday night assault was very surprising.”
– Good Samaritan said: “I’m personally a concealed carry permit holder. I’m not allowed to carry on campus so I’m not going to do that, but at the same time if the university is not going to provide significant resources to provide us the safety we need then at least let me take care of myself with it.
– The university’s response: send out safety ambassadors to create a “welcoming and engaging environment.”
– My response: any school that fails to exercise its right to authorize carry on -campus is responsible for any harm that comes to disarmed students, staff, or civilians.
We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.
Tips and tricks segment : Kathy Jackson’s reply to our feedback on episode 220
Segment 7 Show close
Listener e-mail discussion
Rob: I received this from one of my readers and I like what he said. He calls it “the Equal Protection Amendment”
1. No person holding any office under the United States, or any of them, may keep or bear any arms except those that may be borne by all law abiding competent adult citizens both in his place of residence and in the location of his office.
2. No person holding any office under the United States, or any of them, may be protected by any personal arms he is barred from keeping under the previous article.
Rachel: We’re experimenting with the show all the time. Please send us an e-mail to tell us what you like or dislike. You can contact the show by e-mail. Paul@politics and guns.com, Rachel, Rob, John, Susan, or Onair to reach all of us. Call 605-215-1438605-215-1438 to hear your voice on the air! Rob: That’s 605- 215- 1438605- 215- 1438
Rachel: Also please check out the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam. For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else. Bob is giving away his M&P Shield to one lucky member.
Paul: Listen to other podcasts on thethe Crusader Podcast Network, and give our friend Chaz over at the roadgunner podcast a listen, he just put out a great episode with Daniel shaw of Gunfightercast fame.
Rob: Join the National Rifle Association, Second Amendment Foundation, Gun Owners of America and Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership. Joining two makes you a hero. Supporting all four makes you a super hero. Not belonging to any of them means we won’t loan you any ammunition.
Rachel: Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry,Grass Roots North Carolina, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners,Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry,
Paul: and Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners, Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association and the West Virginia Citizens Defense League.
Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast. Until the mid-week show…
Rob: stay safe,
Rachel: be aware,
John: and we’ll see you down the road.