Episode 334 – Tragedy in Charleston

Full Episode Download: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/334.mp3

Open and Personal News Segment: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/334_open.mp3

News Segment 1: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/334_news_1.mp3

News Segment 2: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/334_news_2.mp3

Interview Segment : Dan Roberts: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/334_dan_roberts.mp3

DGU Segment: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/334_DGU.mp3

Email and Show Close: http://traffic.libsyn.com/politicsandguns/334_close.mp3



“An armed society is a polite society.. and this is the Polite Society Podcast where we support and report on civilian self-defense.”

Paul: Welcome to the polite society podcast presented by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded Sunday, June 21, 2015  I’m Paul Lathrop.

Rob: I’m Rob Morse and on tonights show we will talk about the murders in Charleston, South Carolina at the Emanuel AME church.

Rachel: I’m Rachel Malone and we’ll share good news for Texas knife owners.

George: I’m George Hill, and we’ll talk with Dan Roberts about the ongoing protests at the homes of anti-rights politicians in New Jersey.

Tatiana- I’m Tatiana Whitlock, and we also interview Carl Chinn about security in churches and synagogues..

John Edeen- I’m John Edeen, and we have our weekly news and examples of defensive gun use.. so climb aboard.

George: Buckle Up.

Tatiana : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 334 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.


Seg 1- Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

Rob- I mentored a first shots class for a group of staffers and councilmen from San Diego City Hall.  I found out one of the mentors listens to our podcast.  Made some donations for a local initiative to re-zone gun ranges, and to the New Jersey recall effort.  I’m scheduled to be on Lock and Load radio next Friday, and to mentor another first shots class for medical professionals next Saturday.


Rachel-I’m so glad to be back on the podcast today! The past few months I’ve been taking care of my 10-year-old brother, as well as working through the biggest music jobs of the year. The past several weeks, my two youngest brothers, my sister Deborah, and I took an amazing vacation to Colorado and Wyoming. I attended the weddings of a couple long-time friends and we visited Pikes Peak and Yellowstone, among other thrilling sights. I also enjoyed the freedom to open carry a full-size handgun in NM, CO, WY, MT, and ID. Only a few more months and we’ll be doing that in Texas, too. This weekend I’m instructing a ladies rifle class at Battle Road (online registration here).


George Hill (three sentence biography and any personal gun news this week)


Tatiana Whitlock: I am a Mom, industrial designer, firearms student and instructor and member of the NRA Women’s Network. I am also the owner and designer of ID Target Systems which creates realistic 3D training aids for personal and home defense training. My career took a shift from fine art and design to firearms five years ago. Since then my focus has been in real world, practical application of firearms for home and self defense.

(What did you do this week, Tatiana?)


John Edeen: I am a Pediatric orthopedic surgeon practicing in San Antonio for the past 17 years. I am a Navy veteran have been pursuing firearms training since 2010. I am also the membership director for Doctors for Responsible Gun Ownership. I have been active in the Second Amendment rights movement for two years.


This week I attended the Threat Centered Revolver training course taught by Grant Cunningham in Ohio. The course was hosted by Paul Carlson of Safety Solutions Academy. It is essentially Combat Focus Shooting for the revolver. If you’ve taken CFS, you will recognize many of the general principles of the curriculum. The focus is on the threat and the techniques that are taught are adapted to what your body does under extreme stress. Grant emphasizes using visual information in target selection and shoot-don’t shoot exercises. What makes this course unique is the revolver. Grant teaches the fundamentals of grip and trigger manipulation of the double action revolver first, so by the end of the course, you are doing the shooting automatically. It’s a good thing, because the second day you are using your brain in decision making. Reloading a revolver is a manual skill, with multiple steps that, by the end of the weekend you have mastered by sheer repetition. He showed us some one handed reloading techniques, both strong and weak hand, but emphasized that actual use of these techniques is unlikely in an actual defensive encounter. If you carry a revolver for personal protection, you will benefit from the knowledge you gain from this course. Much of the content of the course can be found in Grant’s book, Defensive Revolver Fundamentals.


Paul Carlson did a great job of organizing the course. The facilities and range were well suited for firearms training and Paul also did some instruction.


A bonus to the course was dinner with David Codrea. David lives nearby,  so I invited him, Grant, Paul and the other students. We had a nice dinner at The Chophouse , but the conversation was lively and stimulating…Paul


Susan – won’t be here for the intro she will be back home as soon as she can, but will be at least late.


Paul – Worked as usual this week. Definitely decided that I am going to order another barrel for the G22, going to get a .357 Sig barrel and see if I like shooting that better. That is one thing that I like about Glocks is their flexibility.


Nothing else gun related. Susan can’t join us at least during the first segment as she is at a meeting at her soon to be former job. She interviewed for and has been offered a job with a considerable raise in responsibility and more importantly pay.


We have been going out on Sunday mornings and have started looking at campers. I want a camper that I can pull behind my Dodge half ton pickup, which means that I am looking at campers on the smaller end. we have 2 absolutes that we are looking for, #1 it MUST have a bathroom (Susan’s requirement) and it MUST have air conditioning (mine)


>live promo about upcoming training classes here.



Seg 2- News


Charleston’s Emanuel AME Church Murders
The staff of the Polite Society Podcast would like to extend our sincere condolences to the friends, family, congregation and community of the nine victims at the Charleston AME church.  We count ourselves as part of the community that is grieving their loss. We surely condemn the evil that raised its head in that holy place.

The devil goes to church too.

‘Boma Exploits the Emanuel AME Murders

The investigation of the Emanuel AME murders had barely started before Obama rushed to his teleprompter to push his agenda of division and gun control. Instead of acting to heal, he did the opposite according to Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal. “I think it was completely shameful. Within 24 hours we’ve got the president trying to score cheap political points.” Jindal observed.


During the seven minute prepared statement Obama said, “At some point, we as a country will have to reckon with the fact that this type of mass violence does not happen in other advanced countries. It doesn’t happen in other places with this kind of frequency. And it is in our power to do something about it.” Obama is mistaken in those statements – no, let’s be honest: he lied. Most, if not all, advanced countries endure mass killings – evil respects no borders. Countries like Finland, Russia, Germany, France and England, have endured these tragedies, some much worse than Columbine, Sandy Hook and Charleston together. We see mass murders with weapons in countries with far more oppressive gun laws than the US. And — Obama certainly does not have the Constitutional power in his pen and phone to override Congress and the Will of the People.


If one of the 12 people present had been armed, the AME massacre might have ended very differently. At fearsome odds, Aaron Guyton, Jeanne Assam, and Charl van Wyk stopped attacks on their churches. They are just a few of the pastors and parishioners who have successfully defended the lives of their flock. Unfortunately, South Carolina makes it illegal to carry a concealed weapon into a church without permission. Good people were disarmed and helpless when evil intruded into their sanctuary.


The host of federal and state laws also failed the victims. Official information is hard to come by, but the killer apparently was able to obtain his weapon over the counter despite his drug addiction and several felony arrests. He violated a host of laws possessing, concealing and transporting the gun. 911 also failed: the police arrived an eternity too late. The killer had enough time to taunt his victims, expend six magazines and then make good his escape. The only thing that could have stopped the hateful spree was a good guy with a gun.

Obama made his comments moments before jetting off to attend three Hollywood fundraisers and put in another round or two of golf.  At one $33,400 a plate function, Obama discussed his plans for gun control with the entertainment industry elite. After all, Matthew Perry knows everything about guns.
One of the Polite Society’s core philosophies is that good guys with guns do good things. Carry your CCW if you can, where you can, when you can. Stand as free men and women; not as victims. Stand.


Comments from Rob, John, Tatiana and George.


Rachel-Apart from legal issues, this story raises other questions that Christian/church-going gun carriers need to have considered, foremost of which, “Is it appropriate to carry in church?” I’m a Christian all week. I worship God and seek to serve Him all week. So I feel if it was inappropriate to carry at church it would also be inappropriate to carry away from church.


Loving and worshipping God involves valuing what He values. He created life, and that life is precious and valuable. I believe in the principle of self-defense not out of spite or vengeance or selfishness, not because I think I’m more important than someone else, but because God made me in His image and I as a person have value.


I believe in protecting others’ lives because they as people made in God’s image have value. This is part of loving my neighbor as myself.


I believe that if another person devalues human life by trying to extinguish it – for example, pulling a gun and beginning to murder people – it is good and right to protect the innocent life, even if that may call for taking the life of the killer. This is valuing justice as well as valuing life.


So, I see value and rightness in welcoming a stranger into one’s midst for a prayer meeting and extending the love of Christ to him, but I also see value and rightness in carrying a firearm and being ready to use it to defend life.


Things that we value help us make choices in living our lives. Sometimes we decide to intentionally make ourselves more vulnerable, but that’s a calculated risk. It’s a decision you make for yourself. Each of us has to weigh safety, living life, enjoying freedom, sharing and loving others.


Rob- This news breaks my heart and it makes me proud of you.  Everyone on this program has taken training and wishes they were sitting in that prayer circle and carrying.  It also makes me wonder about values.  On one hand we’re told that all values are the same.  In that case crazy paranoid racist rants are just a lifestyle choice.  I think values matter and this kid was crazy.


George?  President Obama said that in order to stop violent attacks we have to turn the legally armed US into the disarmed AME church.  That takes a heck of a speech writer to pull that one off.


Tatiana?- The president said we should stop 21 year olds from buying guns because they are too irresponsible.  Is he also advocating raising the age to vote?  +1 DM


John: My passion is to get rid of gun free zones. This unfortunate event demonstrates the futility of a law that disarms the law abiding and allows the evil actors free reign to murder unopposed. This is a moral issue. It is immoral for any legislature to leave gun free zones in place. Every time there is a mass shooting in a gun free zone, the legislature is an accessory and has blood on its hands.


Rob- This crazy murderer proved that magazine capacity restrictions don’t matter.

If I can be funny for a moment, the president said at his fundraiser in Hollywood that anyone could go to a gun show and buy a gun without a background check.  I bet that gave his audience some hope that they could get a gun despite their prior drug convictions.


George- The president is wrong.  Every gun law that applies outside a gun show also applies inside the gun show.



Welcome to the polite society podcast presented by the Firearms Policy Coalition

Of Course She Did
Front running Democrat presidential candidate (gawd help us all) Hillary Clinton lost little time before calling for new restrictions on firearms in the wake of the tragedy at the Emanuel AME church in Charleston. Just as predictable was the standard anti-gun litany of “common-sense” reforms, universal background checks, keeping guns out of the hands of domestic abusers or people suffering from mental illness, or even people on the terror watch list.

Someone should tell Ms Clinton that none of her wish list would have kept the gun out of the murderer’s hands. He apparently passed the background checks they are so fond of.


Paul – in other news water is wet!


-A firearms instructor wanted to do more than be a good witness.  He wanted to prevent another crime before it happened.  The owner of Bear Beam Firearms in Tulsa, Oklahoma offers free training classes to preachers and ministers.  Charles Peters said “Protecting .. their flock is important.  Being prepared for that unfortunate event when it happens needs to take place prior to it happening. Not reacting to it afterwards.  I’ve (offered these classes) before and nobody shows up because nobody thinks it affects them.  The recent event will cause them to see how much it can affect them.”


Peters said he has already received calls from pastors interested in his free course and some have signed up.  He cautions anyone who seeks out a conceal carry permit, that they also need to receive proper safety training. Pastors will only need to show identification showing they’re a pastor or assistant pastor. They will still need to pay any state fees associated with the permit.


Comment- Rob- Why do religious leaders think it is noble to be disarmed victims?



for the Wednesday show->>


Welcome to the polite society podcast presented by the Firearms Policy Coalition

Cuomo Creates ‘Total Cluster F—k’ in Escaped-Killers Hunt
Not only is New York governor Mario Cuomo a rabid anti-gunner, a hard-left progressive, the head of an administration that’s corrupt even by New York standards, and a publicity ho(und), he’s now credited with creating a Total… err… Charlie Foxtrot (no relation) of the hunt for two escaped murderers.

With TV cameras in tow, Cuomo elbowed his way to the scene of the upstate New York prison escape. His unwelcome presence disrupted a crime scene only hours old. The ongoing search is hamstrung by competing agencies, bureaucratic infighting and publicity seeking officials. Heavily armed officers are bumbling about random patches of forest, often without coordination with other groups in the woods. Many are openly talking about the mess the search has become. As the murderers remain at large for days, now weeks, the pressure on Cuomo grows.

Couldn’t happen to a nicer guy.


Texas is definitely NOT New York.  Texas Governor Greg Abbott signed a knife law preemption bill which keeps cities and counties from enacting local knife laws.  City laws such as those in Corpus Christi and San Antonio will be effectively repealed after September first. Cities are allowed to regulate possession of knives in schools, on government property or at certain public events.


John Edeen- Will the San Antonio city council copy Chicago and outlaw knives on public transportation?


Also in the good news category, Nevada changed its reciprocity laws.  Nevada now recognizes the concealed carry permits from 21 other states.  Nevada now recognizes the popular Arizona permit, but not Utah and Florida.  The Nevada legislature also eliminated the handgun registration requirements in Clark County.


Indiana Will Allow Short Barreled Shotguns
As of July 1st, Indiana residents will be allowed to possess shotguns with a barrel length less than 18”. The owner will still have to have the proper federal Class III paperwork for short barrelled shotguns. Which still makes no sense. Heck, Canadians can have short barreled rifles and shotguns without asking for permission and paying a special tax.


-In the not so good news category, the digital ridesharing company Uber now prohibits drivers and passengers from having weapons in its vehicles.  Uber made the change back on June 10.   Both Uber and Lyft are rolling gun-free zones.


Rachel- Does each car come with a little plastic no-guns sign on the window?  Is the driver going to wand me like a TSA checkpoint?  Seriously, I don’t want to get into a car when a thief knows I’m disarmed.


Rob- A regulated company can be pressured to follow ANYTHING the regulators tell it to do.

John- Can Uber be sued if the driver is attacked?


-Rob, you were thinking of moving from California.  Maybe you should consider Puerto Rico.  A class action lawsuit was brought by a group called “the Ladies of the Second Amendment”.  They sued the commonwealth of Puerto Rico to allow firearms purchase and carry without having to show good cause.  The Commonwealth attorney argued that having arms is a privilege and not a right. The intermediate appellate court ruled with the plaintiff citing the Heller and McDonald cases.  Puerto Ricans can now carry, open or concealed, without a permit and they no longer need a permit to purchase a firearm. The court’s ruling also abolished the gun registry in Puerto Rico. All firearms transactions will be handled in accordance with US firearms regulations.


Paul- Freedom is breaking out in unexpected places.  We had Ed Levine with us last week talking about non-resident permits in Washington DC.  He finally picked up his DC carry permit.  Unfortunately, this week a court imposed a stay so DC is again denying carry permits to mere mortals.

Phoney Baloney Maloney

Rep. Carolyn Maloney, D-NY, has found her nitch: the underside of the gun-control rock. This legislative session she has authored bills on the so called gun-show loophole (with a hidden registration requirement), a gun liability insurance mandate, funding for CDC anti-gun studies, and now the Handgun Trigger Safety Act. This bill would require all new handguns to utilize smart gun technology within 5 years, and the retrofit of all handguns within 10. The fact that acceptable smart gun technology doesn’t exist is probably not a bug, but a feature to her.


Fortunately, the above bills don’t have a snowball’s chance in hell of passage in the Republican controlled House. Perhaps, her puppetmasters have other objectives. They may be laying the foundation for when the political pendulum swings to the left again. More likely, they are hoping to get these ideas out to the states and cities. Once there, each anti-gun law must be fought individually, straining the resources of the pro-rights organizations. This could be gun bans by a thousand cuts.

As always, support your local, state and national gun-rights organizations. They’re going to need it.

Bloomberg Funds New Gun News Site ‘The Trace’
Speaking of the puppetmaster: Our ol’ friend Michael Bloomberg is at it again. That Nasty Little Fascist (thank you, Michael Bane) is using his billions to try and change the debate on guns in America. Bloomy is funding a media organization to distribute news about guns. And, of course, impart that unique Bloomberg spin to the news. New York’s “Capital” said the site will be the editorial arm of Bloomberg’s Everytown for Gun Safety. He obviously hopes to become a reference source for mainstream media, like the now largely discredited Brady Bunch was in the past.
A look at “The Trace” website shows a very heavy-handed spin on gun news. The few articles that were briefed (we lacked sufficient blood-pressure medicine) were long on allegations and short on facts. Did you know that Guns Are Now the Weapon of Choice for Violent White Supremacists? If you bothered reading the article, you wouldn’t know much more.

This website does no credit to the already badly damaged standards of journalism. However, it does have that unique Bloomberg stench.


Gun Quotes  (give the gun quote to the person who has said the least so far)

If they think gun buybacks get guns away from criminals, then why don’t they ever do crack and heroin buybacks? That quote is from Facebook.


Paul- Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our interview segment.

advertisement Concealment Solutions

Segment 3 Interviews

Gary Slider of handgunlaw.us.(wednesday?)

Carl Chinn about church security

Dan Roberts about ongoing protests in New Jersey.  Steve Sweeney got his democrat city council members to bar protests in front his house.  The Recall Sweeney event is next week, June 27th.  Sweeney is using the victim card for his special needs daughter claiming the protesters frightened his family.  A mental health search takes less than a week.  Some New Jersey gun owners are afraid of political retribution.


Segment 4 DGUs


Three men approached a resident of Hope MIlls, North Carolina as he arrived home after midnight.  The three thieves drew their firearms and demanded money.  The resident reached back into his car and drew his revolver.  He shot one of the thieves and all three of the thieves then ran off on foot.  The victim was shot in the abdomen, was taken to Cape Fear medical center, and is expected to recover.  Police found one of the thieves wearing latex gloves and with a gunshot wound to his chest.  The thief died before medical help arrived.


Rob- The victim was not carrying.  Three on one.  Six shots doesn’t seem like enough.


Atlanta, Georgia Homeowner Defends His Life Against Two Intruders
An Atlanta Homeowner was forced to overpower an attacker and then shoot him several times in defense of his life. Two men busted through his door at 3 AM. The wounded burglar was taken to the hospital where he died several hours later.

Police are still looking for the other home invader.


-The police tell us to be a good witness.  That sounds like good advice, but could you watch and do nothing while a friend of yours was being robbed at gunpoint?  A thief walked into a Breadbox Convenience store in Knoxville, Tennessee.  He pointed a 9mm pistol at the clerk and forced her behind the counter.   The thief didn’t see the clerk’s friend waiting in the parking lot.  The clerk’s friend grabbed his own handgun and entered the store.  That is when he shot the thief and saved the clerk.  The thief died.


Police called the shooting justified because of the threat to the clerk’s life.  They also reported that the thief’s gun had the serial numbers filed off.. and the police are still trying to trace where the gun was stolen.


Family members of the thief said the friend in the car shouldn’t have gotten involved.

Two Thugs Have a Gun Wrestled Away By A Mom (Do we really want to use this one? RM) (It certainly shows the essential will to overcome and the inadvisability of opening the door to anyone unknown – DM)  
Two thugs got between a momma bear and her cub, but did live to regret it. Barely.

A Nashville woman opened her front door to two men saying they were the police. The masked men blew in, grabbed the homeowner and demanded her money. When she was unable to give them what they wanted, they began to beat her. With her daughter looking on, she resisted and fought back. The fight rolled out onto the front lawn where she was able to grab a thug’s gun and turn it on the cowardly duo. Several shots chased them down the street. Neither suspect is known to have been hit.

The woman was taken to the hospital with cuts and bruises. Her daughter was unharmed. Police have been unable to find the hapless thugs, and have not said if the woman would be charged for firing at the fleeing invaders or if she will be allowed to keep the gun. We say she’s earned it.



Segment 5 Show close

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.


Listener e-mail discussion


Paul- Rob, do you have any new posts from your blog you want to mention?


Rob- I wrote about the murders at the Charleston church and the political protests in New Jersey following the murder of Carol Bowne. Also, we’ve had Amber Kunau on the show.  Amber wrote a powerful piece about the Carol Bowne’s murder and I linked to it.   10 thousand people came by my site to read them.  I want to thank our listeners for sharing these articles since most of my viewers came from Facebook.  The articles are posted at Ammoland, at ClashDaily and on my blog- Slow facts dot wordpress dot com.


Tatiana – Available online via American Shooting Journal are two recent articles that I wrote regarding merging real world training with range time practice and another about the differences between how men and women learn to shoot. http://americanshootingjournal.com/  They have received great feedback and answered many questions I receive from students and instructors alike. I am also honored to be writing for Be Ready magazine so look for articles from me regarding women’s concealed carry and big-picture training in their bi-annual publications.  More information on my training schedule, course offerings and adventures can be found at tatianawhitlock.com.


John- My Articles: The Unthinkable: An Active Shooter in a Hospital and A Tale of Two Shootings can be accessed through drgo.us.


(Ask Tatiana, George and John if they want a shout-out for their articles or activities?)


We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is a big part of what you get to hear.  He writes at his blog “Not One More Gun Law”


Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (Carl Chinn and Dan Roberts) for joining us today.  We have Kenn Blanchard from Black Man witha a Gun, Gary Slider of handgunlaw.us  and Doug Ritter of knife rights scheduled to join us next week.  Rob will you be with us? I’m looking forward to it.  Hopefully John, Gary and Rachel will be back as co-hosts.  Until the next time…

Rachel: stay safe,

John: be aware,

Tatiana: and we’ll see you down the road.


Mention advertisers, Concealment Solutions, Crusader Weaponry and NJ2AS. Firearm Safety Institute


(after show close) How could we have made this episode better?


(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam.  For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else.  Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.


(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment,  Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue,  Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and  Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.


There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance,  Nebraska Firearms Owners Association,   Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association,  Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry,  West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.


For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association.  If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!


(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box.  They are located by our old name, Politics and guns.  Hot links are in our show notes.