Rachel: Welcome to the polite society podcast recorded live on Wednesday, October 8th, 2014. I’m Rachel Malone.
John: I’m John Richardson, and we have a recorded interview with Vik Khanna from the gun rights policy conference.
Rob: I’m Rob Morse and we have our weekly news and stories of defensive gun use.. so climb aboard.
John: strap in!
Rachel: and hang on! Episode 274 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.
Show intro music.
Seg 1- Personal news from each participant
Rachel- I had a girls’ shopping date with a friend of mine today…..a holster and ammo shopping date, that is. We found her a great holster at GT Distributors that allows her to carry a Glock 23 concealed. For a girl with a smaller frame, that’s pretty sweet.
John – Nothing really to report since Sunday afternoon. I’m waiting for my invitation to Media Day at SHOT Show. I understand that Paul and Susan have gotten their invitations. I hope they will put in a good word for me!
Rob- Dry practice and work.
Seg 2- News
John -The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms has a long history. Recently it is a history of corruption and incompetence. There is a website called “clean up ATF” where the field agents complain about their management. Unfortunately, the management retaliates if anyone complains too loudly. They tried to make an example of ATF field agent Vincent Cefalu. Agent Cefalu went to court in his wrongful termination case last week. This week the judge dismissed ATF’s attempt to fire Cefalu. The judge ruled that unfounded charges must be removed from his personnel record, the ATF owes Cefalu for his legal costs, the agency must restore Cefalu’s retirement funds by the end of the month, and they must pay an undisclosed settlement award. After the verdict, agent Cefalu made an open post addressed to ATF Director B. Todd Jones and Deputy Director Thomas E. Brandon.
“You allowed the agency to abuse me and my family for eight years only to admit you were wrong. Nothing in the case changed over the last two years, yet you refused to settle, continued wasting taxpayers’ dollars and precious court time only to do what you should have done years ago.. You still have to reconcile not only keeping the managers responsible for this on your payroll, but promot[ing] them. You have been aware of the perjury, false statements … gross mismanagement and waste, fraud and abuse by members of your executive staff and field managers and have done nothing. In fact you went to heroic measures to defend them.
“My true win comes from the knowledge that the field does not and will not accept your reckless leadership and [is] not afraid to call you out anymore.”
With bad managment like this, no wonder there is a morale problem at the ATF. Yeah, and their agency lawyers are spending time fighting internal lawsuits rather than prosecuting violent criminal behavior.
Rob- There are similar problems at the Federal Bureau of Investigation. Senator Chuck Grassley of Iowa said eleven whistleblowers in the FBI say the bureau is targeting them for termination in retaliation for their revelations about FBI wrongdoing. Senator Grassley is the ranking Republican on the Senate Committee on the Judiciary. The FBI set out to punish whistleblowers in a way the whistleblowers could not oppose. They were served with Loss of Effectiveness orders and warned that their performance is suffering and that they could soon be fired. These letters bypass the FBI’s Office of Professional Responsibility, so the whistleblowers would never have a chance to protest their evaluation. Quoting Senator Grassley, “It’s stereotypical treatment of whistleblowers by the executive branch.” These letters sent to the FBI employees mark the first major case showing how newly appointed FBI Director James B. Comey may react to internal whistleblowers. If these allegations are true, the FBI’s treatment of whistleblowers stands in stark contrast with how it treats agents who have been found by [internal investigators] to have committed actual, disciplinable offenses,” The senator cited the case of an FBI agent who was having a relationship with a foreign citizen and had divulged sensitive information. The agent was never sent a Loss of Effectiveness (LOE) letter, and the agent’s case was handled through the Office of Professional Responsibility, he said.
Rachel- The Indianapolis Star researched violent crimes committed with a firearm during the last five years. They found three thousand of examples where prosecutors bargained away the firearms charges for a guilty plea to a lesser offense. The plea bargains make life easier for prosecutors. The plea bargains also cost lives when violent criminals are returned to the streets to kill again. One such criminal was Leandrew Beasley. Beasley was a drug dealer who shot several people while he should have been serving time in jail for his prior convictions. Many of the criminals studied had a long list of prior arrests. This was particularly true of murderers. Evidently murder takes practice. The report concluded that prosecuting repeat felons under existing laws would save lives.
Rob -Indianapolis is not alone in costing innocent lives. Los Angeles is stuck on stupid and passes more gun restrictions while their crime rate goes up. The LA City Council voted to ban the possession of “high capacity” magazines within city limits. While the Ninth U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals ruled that restrictions on concealed carry had to be eased, the LA County Sheriffs Department refused to comply with the judges’ ruling. The LA City Council lobbied the state legislature to ban “single shot” handguns, a ban which was implemented on the state level. At the state level, California restricted lead ammo, expanding criminal firearm storage rules, requiring safety certificates for owners of long guns, and expanding background checks. All the while, crime rose in Los Angeles. According to the Los Angeles Times, LA’s “overall violent crime rate is up 7.6 percent year to year. Aggravated assaults increased by nearly 20 percent. and the incidence of rape was up 7 percent.
rachel comment- Insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results.
john comment- the politicians will keep selling gun control as long as the voters will buy it.
Rachel- Pro-Mag is a magazine and gun component manufacturer with a considerable share of the market. They moved their business from anti-gun California to pro-gun and pro-business Arizona. General manager Mike Kurvink said that the move was sparked by California’s gun and business laws that made it nearly impossible to do business. They took 200 employees and 40 truck loads of equipment with them as they moved to Phoenix.
comment- well done, Pro-Mag
John -Here is a story of progress for Alabama gun owners. The use of sound suppressors for hunting became legal as of October first. Federal tax stamps are still required. Until earlier this year, the Alabama Department of Conservation and Natural Resources prohibited the use of suppressors/silencers. Now Alabama joins thirty other states who allow hunters to use suppressors while hunting.
Several countries consider hunting without a suppressor to be rude since the noise bothers the neighbors. Those countries didn’t have alcohol prohibition in the 1930s and didn’t have our firearms laws that were supposed to control the organized crime that grew out of prohibition.
comment- using a suppressor makes you a good neighbor.
comment- John, are you going to get a suppressor for your pig gun?
Rob -A lie can travel halfway around the world before the truth pulls on its pants. Anti-gun activist Mark Kelly lied on national television about how firearms transactions occur without a background check. Kelly said only 60 percent of all gun sales occur with a background check. The statistic is false and misleading. The data comes from a few hundred phone interviews conducted 20 years ago. The limited data includes sales made before background checks were required by law. That is a fact you won’t hear on CNN.
comment-John – And THAT is why we have listeners to the Polite Society Podcast
Rachel -The intolerance of anti-gunners has reached a new high. Nino Ferlaino, a seasonal landscaping employee of the Crown Point, Indiana Lakes of the Four Seasons gated community was fired on July 2nd for merely owning a gun. His supervisor asked him if it was true he carried a firearm to which Mr. Ferlaino replied that he owned a firearm but did not carry it at work. Ferlaino was fired because the gated community had a “no tolerance policy”. Mr. Ferlaino is now suing the Lakes of the Four Seasons Property Owners Association Inc. for actual and punitive damages, attorney’s fees, and an injunction preventing them from taking similar actions against other employees. The homeowner’s association’s are in violation of an Indiana law passed in 2011 which forbids employers from asking if their employees own guns. Moreover, most employees have the right to store their firearm in their vehicles while at work.
john Comment – I hope this group of anti-gunners has deep pockets
rob Comment – and that Mr. Ferlaino takes a lot of their money.
John – With Election Day less than a month away, it is important for gun owners and gun right supporters to know who our friends are, who only pays lip service to the Second Amendment, and who really is after our guns. To find who who is pro-gun, we suggest checking out the NRA Political Victory Fund site as well as those from the many state-level organizations. To make it easier to figure out who pays lip service or hates us, Everytown Moms for Illegal Mayors have released their own endorsements. As Bob Owens of BearingArms points out, Bloomberg didn’t want to be seen doing the endorsements himself. You will find such anti-gun luminaries as Cal AG Kamala Harris, CT Gov Dan Malloy, and NY Gov Andrew Cuomo on the list along with others who pretend to support the Second Amendment like Senators Kay Hagan, Mark Udall, and Mary Landrieu.
John – The Durham County (NC) Sheriffs Department finally has destroyed a handgun registry that had been in existence since 1935. While the county repealed the law authorizing the registry as mandated by the General Assembly, they were unwilling to actually destroy the records claiming they had historical relevance. It was only after Grass Roots North Carolina threatened to sue the Sheriffs Department and the county that steps were taken to shred the record cards. Clerk of Court Archie Smith and Sheriff Mike Andrews filmed the destruction of the records which can be seen on YouTube.
Rob -Connecticut got this one wrong. Scott Lazure was a security guard. He had a concealed carry permit in Connecticut. You may not know that Connecticut allows open carry with a concealed carry license, and Scott was open carrying. The police certainly forgot that open carry is allowed. In Connecticut, there is also no requirement to inform the police that you have a concealed carry permit. Police approached Scott, and asked to see his identification. He refused, since a citizen is not required to produce identification unless they are charged with a crime. This went to court and Scott won. The judge told the police to return Scott’s firearm. That is when the issuing authority, the state Board of Firearms Permit Examiners, revoked Scott’s permit to carry. Now that decision is headed to court. It seems likely that Michael Lawlor, the undersecretary for criminal justice policy and planning for Governor Dannel Malloy, sent down word to deny Scott Lazure’s permit. Governor Malloy is in a heated race for Governor against the pro-gun candidate Tom Foley. The police need guidance and leadership. That starts from the top, and Connecticut gun owners should be involved in this race for governor.
Comment – Mike Vanderboegh wrote about Lawlor in the past speculating that he was a KGB plant.
Rachel- This officer has his internal compass set and it guides his actions. Officer Ben Hall was going to cite a woman for driving her 5 year old without a car seat. The woman agreed that she needed a car seat, but said her family had fallen on some hard times recently. Her car had been repossessed along with her daughter’s car seat. Now they didn’t have the money for a new car seat. The officer could have fined her and given her a ticket. He’s done exactly that before, but not this time. Officer Hall bought her a car seat instead. Hall said “..what she was going through.. was something anyone could have been going through. Giving her a ticket.. doesn’t solve the problem.. I talked to the mother about different organizations that give out car seats but it was Friday night.. and we needed something right now.”
They found a 55 dollar car seat at Walmart and Officer Hall paid for it. I hope the rest of the officers in Emmett Township, Michigan are that thoughtful. He has helped us all with his example.
john comment- Why talk about this on the Polite Society Podcast?
rob comment- because if we criticize the police when they get it wrong then we have to recognize them when they get it right.
John -Law enforcement understands violence, but the politicians are playing games with people’s lives in New York, Tony Oliva writes at his blog “Bullets First”. He documented a one man crime spree by a convicted rapist in New York. The criminal attempted one abduction in a gun-free zone of a shopping center parking lot. He later kidnapped and raped a second woman at gunpoint. The criminal kidnapped a second man and made him drop him off at a college campus. Another gun free zone. In short, a violent rapist gets released from jail, quickly gets a gun despite the New York SAFE Act, chooses gun free zones to attack victims and is finally caught on a gun free zone college campus about to repeat his crimes all over again. This is as close to proof as we will ever find that firearms restrictions disarm honest citizens and not criminals.
Rob- Gun Quotes- “We shall have lost something vital and beyond price on the day when the state denies us the right to resort to force…” – Justice Louis Brandeis in The Brandeis Guide to the Modern World, 1941.
Rachel- Hang on everybody, we’ll be back after this
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Segment 3 Interview
Segment 4 DGUs
Rachel -This DGU was sent in by Scott who lives in Texas. Three intruders broke into a home just west of Houston in Katy, Texas. One of the homeowners was jumped and tackled by two masked intruders who taped his arms and feet. They tried to get into his safe. The homeowner played dead when the thieves tried to choke him. Quote “All I could think about was my daughter.” The thieves ransacked the two-story home. At one point the homeowner raised his head and the the thieves said, quote “if you look up again, we’ll kill you.” The homeowner opened his gun safe and waited for the thieves.
Two of the thieves were airlifted to the hospital for emergency surgery because of multiple gunshot wounds. The third suspect is being sought by police.
John -Despite its western reputation, Texas has some work to do on its firearms laws. Four armed men entered a bar in Northwest Harris County. Most of the crowd had gone home. It was after closing time as the staff cleaned up EJ’s Place. A few customers lingered. One was a regular who routinely walked the female staff to their cars after closing. The four criminals ordered everyone to lie face down on the ground. That is when one of the regular customers shot and killed two of the armed thieves. The other two criminals fled. Under Texas law, even licensed carriers can’t have guns in bars. That could explain why the armed customer who saved lives left the bar before police arrived.
Rob -The police are minutes away when you need them. A Lake Elsinore, California couple called police when an intruder tried to enter their house just before 11 pm Sunday night. The male homeowner retrieved his handgun and shouted to the intruder that he was armed. The intruder smashed in a window anyway. The homeowner fired and the intruder fled. Paramedics took the intruder to a local medical center where he died of his injuries. The police do not expect to press charges against the homeowner.
rachel comment- There is some justice even in California.
john comment- I wonder if the criminal was stupid, or intoxicated.
rachel -A domestic dispute escalated and ended in a self-defense shooting. An unmarried couple in Lima, Ohio argued in front of the woman’s parents. First the man was asked to leave, and then the man was forced to leave. The homeowners called police. The man returned later after the police had left.. That is when the man and a friend, Markquis Hall and Ja’Taven Dukes began shooting at the house. The family called police again and the pregnant woman hid with her 9 month old baby in a hall closet. The woman is recorded on the 911 call saying, ““He’s shooting. He has a gun and he’s shooting on the inside and there’s an infant in here. Can you all please hurry up.” Hall and Dukes, both in their mid 20s, were shot as they broke through a window to enter the home. Dukes died and Hall was arrested by police at St. Rita’s Medical Center seeking treatment for a gunshot wound.
comment- Thank god someone had a gun.
Rob- We have the links to each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com if you want to share them with a friend.
Tips and tricks
Segment 5 Show close
Listener e-mail discussion
(DO NOT READ)The Polite Society download app is out on Amazon for Android and the I-phone app is in I-tunes and it is called Podcast Box. They are located by our old name, Politics and guns. Hot links are in our show notes.
Rachel- Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?
Rachel, that article about armed women I promised you was picked up by Ammoland and Keep and Bear Arms.
Rob John do you want to mention anything off of your blog you would like to talk about?
John- Go fund me for Paul. Here is the link- http://www.gofundme.com/fg2dhw
(DO NOT READ)Look at the shooters club by Bob Mayne and Ben Branam. For $75.00 a year, $6.25 a month, you get 24/7 access to some fantastic training and audio podcasts that you can’t get anywhere else. Subscribing from the link in our show notes helps Bob and Ben as well as helps us here at the Polite Society Podcast.
(DO NOT READ)Join your local civil rights group like the New Jersey Second Amendment Society, Arizona Citizens Defense League, Gun Owners of California, Commonwealth Second Amendment, Connecticut Citizens Defense League, Florida Carry, Georgia Carry, Georgia Gun Owners, Grass Roots North Carolina, Illinois Carry, Maryland Shall Issue, Michigan Gun Owners , Michigan Open Carry, and Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners.
There are Minnesota Gun Owners Civil Rights Alliance, Nebraska Firearms Owners Association, Citizens for a Safer New Jersey, New York State Rifle & Pistol Association, Palmetto Concealed Carry, Open Carry Texas, Texas Firearms Freedom, Texas State Rifle Association. Tennessee Firearms Association, Virginia Citizens Defense League, Virginia Open Carry, West Virginia Citizens Defense League, wisconsingunowners.org, and Wyoming Gun Owners.
For our Canadian listeners, and their supporters, join the Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian National Firearms Association. If YOUR state or local organization isn’t read each episode, then send us an email and we’ll add them!
Rachel: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast. I’d like to thank (Guests) for joining us today. co-hosts, will you be with us next time? I’m looking forward to it. Until the next time…
John: stay safe,
Rob: be aware,
Rachel: and we’ll see you down the road.